Will they wreck or improve Janto in Season 3?

[torchwoody]

What are people's thoughts and hopes on how the writers will treat Jack and Ianto's developing relationship in the new season? Will they enhance it :ok: or $&#%& it up? :fie:

[fan of love]

Will they wreck Janto??! *dies at the thought of it* No. They definitely would not wreck Janto since it's proved to have been the most popular pairing..I think..?

[Chelle]

I think they'll probably improve it - they can't just let us all down now after all! It'd be like going backwards.

xxx

[PterodactylJo]

They have to advance it.
Even though they say they don't read reviews or internet forums, they must be aware of how popular it is.

It'd be stupid to stop it. Well I hope they won't. :omg:

[ElectroxGirl]

Wasn't it Julie Gardner who said she loved Janto and there will be more in series 3?

[torchwoody]

I'm also hopefully optimistic they'll improve it, but I also don't underestimate the ability for any tv show to screw it all up for the fans hehe. :wink:

One of my favorite bits of season two was the asking out on a date scene. In the middle of hunting time traveling aliens and saving the world from supernatural catastrophe, there was a moment of reality. That Jack needed to ask Ianto if he was ok, and realize that even though they seem to have skipped a few steps, they needed to do something as banal (in a good way) and commonplace as go to a movie or dinner. They may not be your average couple, but there was a need to do what every other couple in the world does when starting out. It was also a touchstone of normality beyond all the sportscar driving blowfish. I found it very touching. In some sense it makes Janto the most understandable, healthy, romantic, and 'normal' relationship on the show, and so I'd like to see more aspects of that brought out in series 3.

[ElectroxGirl]

I just love that throughout that year in DW he had been thinking about Ianto. That's also probably one of the reasons he wanted the date. He realized what he had and didn't want to lose him, therefore wanted to have a proper relationship

[U.N.I.T.]

Personally, I wouldn't be suprised if the relationship goes in an unexpected direction. Jack is an Omnisexual chap who isn't necessarily the settling down kind. Ianto is potentially still grieving for his lost love. Their relationship may well be a very hot topic and great ratings puller but realistically, are the two of them really in this for the dating and romance or to let off steam and have a shag with no strings attached. We never did see them on their 'date'...!

[PoisonIvy]

I highly doubt they'll [purposefully] muck it up (no telling what happens by accident).

Seriously, Julie Gardner says she LOVES it and it's got her vote to stay on, always a plus. AND, they took the extra couple of seconds to establish it in DW. That has to say something. I mean, for non-TW fans, they showed in a matter of seconds that Gwen was married/in love with some guy named Rhys (based on the phone call) and that Jack and Ianto were in some sort of relationship for Ianto to demand clarification on the "solider in a bar" comment. Why take that time if you're going to just drop it next series? Why lure DW fans into watching TW and establish certain notions only to completely mess them up once they get there?

If the glove don't fit... you must acquit!

[ElectroxGirl]

The date was mentioned in one of the books though, which was written by Gary Russell the script editor. He must know a lot about it.

[PoisonIvy]

Personally, I wouldn't be suprised if the relationship goes in an unexpected direction. Jack is an Omnisexual chap who isn't necessarily the settling down kind. Ianto is potentially still grieving for his lost love. Their relationship may well be a very hot topic and great ratings puller but realistically, are the two of them really in this for the dating and romance or to let off steam and have a shag with no strings attached. We never did see them on their 'date'...!

Erm, Gareth has stressed over and over again that Ianto is in love with Jack. At Dragon*Con this past weekend when asked about Jack possibly leaving Ianto, he said it'd break Ianto's heart (unless the writers wrote it otherwise, he thinks it would destroy Ianto especially after having lost Lisa). In "Adam", Ianto says his reasons for moving on from Lisa, for surviving/living are Torchwood and Jack. Ianto, at the very least, is in it to win it.

And as I said above, it says something that Jack reassures Ianto in the DW finale that it was "strictly professional" in reference to the solider. If Jack didn't think Ianto had the right to demand such things from him, he wouldn't have been so quick to placate him. Not to mention that Ianto felt comfortable enough to ask it to begin with.

[strawberryfields]

*nods vigorously at what PI said and really really hopes it continues in series 3* :yes:

[U.N.I.T.]

Personally, I wouldn't be suprised if the relationship goes in an unexpected direction. Jack is an Omnisexual chap who isn't necessarily the settling down kind. Ianto is potentially still grieving for his lost love. Their relationship may well be a very hot topic and great ratings puller but realistically, are the two of them really in this for the dating and romance or to let off steam and have a shag with no strings attached. We never did see them on their 'date'...!

Erm, Gareth has stressed over and over again that Ianto is in love with Jack. At Dragon*Con this past weekend when asked about Jack possibly leaving Ianto, he said it'd break Ianto's heart (unless the writers wrote it otherwise, he thinks it would destroy Ianto especially after having lost Lisa). In "Adam", Ianto says his reasons for moving on from Lisa, for surviving/living are Torchwood and Jack. Ianto, at the very least, is in it to win it.

And as I said above, it says something that Jack reassures Ianto in the DW finale that it was "strictly professional" in reference to the solider. If Jack didn't think Ianto had the right to demand such things from him, he wouldn't have been so quick to placate him. Not to mention that Ianto felt comfortable enough to ask it to begin with.I certainly wouldn't want to dispute what you've heard and observed but I still can't help feeling there's more (or less) going on than we all see. It's been a rather censored affair in many respects - we catch glimpses of passion and see an obvious bond, tinged with jealousy but nothing to cement them as a exclusive couple on screen.

I'd perhaps like to see the dating and coupledom to re-inforce the strengthening bond... Animal passion may make better viewing but we see far more of Gwen & Rhys as a couple and can believe their commitment (well, Rhys's!) to one another.

I can't shake the niggling feeling that perhaps one of them started out using the other, even if I can't define which. Albeit that the dynamics of their initial flirtation has taken them to a rather unexpected level.

Can Jack ever settle down? I'm not wholly convinced. Is Ianto ready for something so full on? Again, not wholly convinced.

[PoisonIvy]

Hmmm... I guess my issue is that we've seen nothing to... erm... what's the opposite of "cement"?.... "liquefy"? That'll do... we've seen nothing to liquefy their exclusive coupleness either. That is to say, once Jack came back Series 2 and asked Ianto out officially (therefore moved it from office shag to dating), there's been no indication that either of them has strayed. And the scene where Jack reminisces about his own marriage shows that Jack can commit himself to someone (otherwise, there’s no point getting married, especially for someone beyond our “quaint” categories). This "space-slut" definition of Jack is one propagated by DW but not supported in TW. He's a flirt, yes, excessively so, but then so is JB... and JB, last I heard, was happily committed.

Hence my stressing that scene in DW: The Stolen Earth because I find that quite telling. To a DW audience they, in one bit of dialog, showed that Ianto not only has the balls to question Jack's actions but feels he has the right to and that Jack doesn't shy away from that right or chafe under it, but assuages it calmly. Uncommitted people wouldn't demand fidelity and their partner wouldn't be so quick to pacify their fears. And that this is what they choose to show DW audiences (that is, people who have possibly never seen TW) paralleled to Gwen’s phone call to Rhys in order to highlight the dynamics of the interpersonal relationships on TW, well, they do it quite spectacularly and succinctly.

The Rhys-Gwen domesticity, as discussed elsewhere, is more plot relevant than the Janto, I’m afraid. Sure, I’d rather see the Janto, but I do understand that in the gist of the overall workings of the story it’s not as necessary. Moreover, I suffer under the impression that lines like, “loved people I never would have known, if I had just stayed where I was… (cue dramatic lingering eye contact) and I wouldn’t change that for the world” in TTLM and “Coming here gave me meaning again… you!” in Adam demonstrate a deeper level of affection than simply sex buddies. In fact, the first one is pretty much a barefaced declaration of love! Not to mention episode descriptions like “Jack’s love of Ianto saves the day” for Adam, GDL’s repetitious stressing that Ianto is in love with Jack (and I heard the last one about him being “devastated should Jack leave” with my own two ears, live from the source), and the BBCA’s Captain’s Blog going even further to highlight it really push the point home.

No, it’s not blatant and yes I can see how that ambiguity can be frustrating and lead to some apprehension, but it’s fantastic in that it allows the writers to play with it more. As Nathan Fillion said, realizing such relationships fully on tv “gets your show cancelled”. You’ve got to leave something to keep the audience intrigued and the stories fresh.

[Magicrie]

I agree with you PI. I would love to see more of their relationship but to me both men are very private and guarded and until we as an audience are allowed to see more of those 'private moments' we will only be left with the bits of body language, glances and spoken words. I think it is very telling of the trust both professionally and personally when in The Stolen Earth - Ianto steps in front of Jack (basically pushing him aside) to speak to Hariet Jones. I don't think we would have seen that in S1 or maybe in the beginning of S2.

I also don't think we will see too much of it in S3 since it is a shorten season..but hopefully I am wrong! They can pack bunches into an episode so *crossing fingers* they can sqeeze more Janto in for us.

[U.N.I.T.]

PoisonIvy - I really respect your arguments - you're swaying me somewhat! I would comment on a few points though...


Uncommitted people wouldn't demand fidelity and their partner wouldn't be so quick to pacify their fears. I'd argue this point. Even those who are starting out in a new relationship should be able to expect a degree of fidelity! Though cutures may differ - dating in the UK tends to be more exclusive than in the US for example.



Sure, I’d rather see the Janto, but I do understand that in the gist of the overall workings of the story it’s not as necessary. Do you not think so? Captain Jack is a central role - his relationships have defined some storylines... Captain John for example!


Moreover, I suffer under the impression that lines like, “loved people I never would have known, if I had just stayed where I was… (cue dramatic lingering eye contact) and I wouldn’t change that for the world” in TTLM and “Coming here gave me meaning again… you!” in Adam demonstrate a deeper level of affection than simply sex buddies.Point taken - alas, I haven't had quite the opporutnity to re-watch and read between the lines or take in moments that are missed on first viewing - And that's not meant in a demeaning way to those that have... It's a luxury I would love to have!
GDL’s repetitious stressing that Ianto is in love with Jack (and I heard the last one about him being “devastated should Jack leave” with my own two ears, live from the source), Whilst hte cast may have opinions, theorys and desires, I have to remain slightly skeptical of those not actually writing the scripts - though I'd be more than happy to share a private audience with GDL to hear everything he has to say... :evilpink:


As Nathan Fillion said, realizing such relationships fully on tv “gets your show cancelled”. Firefly? I was never aware of why it was curtailed so cruelly!

---

And Magicrie - also an interesting point...


... both men are very private and guardedIndeed! Perhaps this is played out partly in a kind of censorship then, to ensure we remain outsiders?

[Aquila]

Yeah, I agree with PI as well. Gwen and Rhys has more relevance because it connects TW to our world, to our day to day lives...despite my hesitations about liking Gwen as a character, I can understand why she's consistently said to be the 'heart' of the show, or the audience's view in. It's her relationship with Rhys that is so, so important for that reason. Actually, Rhys has pretty much taken over for Gwen's role in that sense...he's our 'common man' in TW, he's anchored in the regular world, but since Meat he's seen more and more, glimpses of TW that he (and we) can relate to.

Jack and Ianto otoh...while I am a HUGE Janto shipper (perhaps you've noticed :wink:) their relationship is not important in that sense. It's wonderful that Jack has the love and support that Ianto clearly gives him, that he can trust Ianto with those little bits of himself (OoTR for instance) and parts of TW's business that he doesn't want common knowledge (Adrift) ...and it's also lovely to see Ianto growing out of the self imposed shell he was encased in during s1, not to mention developing his skills with Jack's encouragement...but it's not essential for us (innocents that we are) to connect to that world.

I think we'll see some more moments between them...at the very least moments like the ones we've had last season, the banter, (ie Sleeper) the looks (ie the 'sad and single' scene in Meat) the 'working dates' (which I think are partly just so they can spend some time together...ie Weevil hunting) and the glimpses of conversations they are having/have had. (Ootr and the 'as you know' bit in SB) Perhaps they'll be more comfortable showing that affection in s3...not only do high stress events bring that out in a lot of people, but with just the four of them (Jack and Ianto, Gwen and Rhys) I think it's likely we'll get some more obvious allusions to their relationship...especially as it's established and common knowledge between the team. (Yes, I'm including Rhys at this point.)

I'm hoping for something coupley...just one little thing. Like them getting ready in the morning, or an embrace at a critical moment...a snog won't go amiss either. I'm not holding my breath, but I think we'll get at least something like that, given the responses that various cast and crew have had in regards to questions about them. I doubt very much we'll see any skin (mores the pity) but I feel certain that their relationship will take a step forward and we'll get a glimpse of it...enough to tide us over until s4 which will hopefully be a full series...or almost. *begs*

Anyway, I am certain that we'll see more, what that more may be is all speculation at this point. But I seriously doubt that s3 will ruin them...I have a feeling (wishful thinking perhaps, but still) that their relationship will end with Ianto's death...and I'll go out on a limb to say it'll happen in season 5. Yes, yes I do believe we'll get a s5. :D

That is, unless Ianto is just biding time until he can 'watch (Jack) suffer and die.' Srsly I don't think that will ever happen, I believe they have moved way past those words spoken in the heat of the moment and that the affection we see is genuine. But still. The possibility is in my mind, just hanging around the fringes. :sorry:

Good lord, I'm chatty tonight. :laugh2:

[PoisonIvy]

Uncommitted people wouldn't demand fidelity and their partner wouldn't be so quick to pacify their fears. I'd argue this point. Even those who are starting out in a new relationship should be able to expect a degree of fidelity! Though cutures may differ - dating in the UK tends to be more exclusive than in the US for example.

That's my point, though. If they were just engaging in meaningless sex, Ianto wouldn't even question it. If Jack was free to rove about, having sex with whomever, then Ianto wouldn't feel he had the right to question it. But, that he feels he has the right, and Jack isn't put off by this display of possessiveness, demonstrates a certain understanding of exclusivity. Even you just said, "even those who are starting out in a new relationship should be abe to expect a degree of fidelity", that right there implies there must be a sense of "relationship" to warrant this allowance for expecting fidelity, and that's why I find that scene significant. If they were just comfort/meaningless/boredom sex, then there's no actual relationship there and there's no need to be so possessive. But, that Ianto shows he's expecting that fidelity from Jack, then there is obviously some unspoken agreement that whatever they are to each other allows for that assumption.

On the US thing, um... if you are basing this off of tv, then errr... there's you're problem. You do realize that we are a puritanical empire (of doom), right? I mean, this country was started because your country wasn't godly enough :rolleyes: (that's at the US, not the UK... I LOVE the UK! *hugs it*) . Dating in the US is generally pretty exclusive. In fact, it's the Europeans we view as more "open minded". I vaguely recall this misconception of America being more liberated and free when I lived in London, but we're not. We are soooo not! Trust me. I never knew Life of Brian had full frontal until I was watching it on the BBC. We censor EVERYTHING! :tongue:



Sure, I’d rather see the Janto, but I do understand that in the gist of the overall workings of the story it’s not as necessary. Do you not think so? Captain Jack is a central role - his relationships have defined some storylines... Captain John for example!

Overall point of his character, no, Jack is not defined by his relationships... it may affect certain episodes, but not to the same degree as Gwen/Rhys. As Gwen becomes more and more a part of TW, it's Rhys that keeps her as the link to the outside world. It's Rhys that keeps her grounded. The entire point of Gwen was to be our connection into TW, without Rhys at this point, her character would fail. She'd have nothing to fight for and no link to reality. By her relationship with Rhys, we as an audiance are reminded of what happens beyond the Hub, what TW is fighting so hard to protect... even by extension, this is why Gwen is important to Jack. She reminds him of this, she makes him the hero (while, Ianto makes him the man). And thus, Jack/Ianto isn't as important in the sense of the overall show, because they are both Torchwood. Neither one of them brings something to this world that isn't already there. Gwen's link to Rhys always draws us back to reality, it has deeper significance on the workings of the plot.

However, Jack's relationship with Ianto is important to defining Jack so we do get some of it, in order to understand who Jack is and why. But, it's not as important as Gwen/Rhys. Hell, even just Gwen/Rhys playing around in bed brings us out of the Hub, out of TW, just by location and connotation. Jack/Ianto cannot do this, because they're always TW, they'll always invoke it. There's a shadow lingering over them (and no, it's not Mwfanwy! :tongue:)



GDL’s repetitious stressing that Ianto is in love with Jack (and I heard the last one about him being “devastated should Jack leave” with my own two ears, live from the source), Whilst hte cast may have opinions, theorys and desires, I have to remain slightly skeptical of those not actually writing the scripts - though I'd be more than happy to share a private audience with GDL to hear everything he has to say... :evilpink:

Oh, I understand... that's why Gareth amended his statement and said Ianto would get over Jack leaving him if the writer's dictated he would... but, based on his own current understanding of the character, he sees Ianto as being devistated (an understanding that seems pretty spot-on, considering he approached RTD with his theories on what eventually did come about in Cyberwoman well before they got to it). I just cite him because he has a certain inside knowledge of Ianto. I mean, he thinks deeply about his character's motives to play him properly... so, even if the writers end up not intending for Ianto to be in love with Jack, to date Gareth has been playing him as such.

Plus, it helps that he said this a few minutes after saying he'd read the first 3 scripts for series 3. I don't think he was meaning to give anything away, but he was quite confidant that Ianto would be broken without Jack (hypothetically, I don't think he was suggesting it happens, but if it did) and that's after 3 more episodes worth of insight that we aren't privy to.



As Nathan Fillion said, realizing such relationships fully on tv “gets your show cancelled”. [color=#00bf80]Firefly? I was never aware of why it was curtailed so cruelly!

Oh, no... it got cancelled because the Execs at Fox are stupid bastards. Mr. Fillion was just joking around when a fan asked him whom Mal would have ended up with sooner, Saffron or Inara... to which he replied that Inara and Mal had a star-crossed love, and the culmination of that on screen would "get your show cancelled"... pun being that it didn't matter, as the show got cancelled anyway. He's a cheeky bugger! :grin:

[U.N.I.T.]

On the US thing, um... if you are basing this off of tv, then errr... there's you're problem. My apologies... It's 4am here on my second long night shift... usually I remember to disregard what I see on TV as culturally accurate! :erm: :evilpink: No offense intended!
...Gwen's link to Rhys always draws us back to reality, it has deeper significance on the workings of the plot. I suppose I have a problem with your points regarding Gwen because I simply find her unlikeable. I don't relate to her particuarly so perhaps find it more difficult to regard her relationship with Rhys as anything more than a sideline to the points I'm more interested in.

As for drawing me back to reality - That's always a difficult task! :evilpink:
the Execs at Fox are stupid bastardsNo argument from me! Were they responsible for Dark Angel too?

---

I get what you mean about GDL now... You were witholding relevant information before! :evilpink: x2

[PoisonIvy]

My apologies... It's 4am here on my second long night shift... usually I remember to disregard what I see on TV as culturally accurate! :erm: :evilpink: No offense intended!

No offense felt! If anything, I wish the US was as it is perceived elsewhere. I was just saying, we're a bunch of fanatical Christian, right-winged boobs (look at our President, can't get stupider than that!). Get me out of here!!! :shout:



...Gwen's link to Rhys always draws us back to reality, it has deeper significance on the workings of the plot. [color=#00bf80]I suppose I have a problem with your points regarding Gwen because I simply find her unlikeable. I don't relate to her particuarly so perhaps find it more difficult to regard her relationship with Rhys as anything more than a sideline to the points I'm more interested in.

I agree for the most part, though I've grown to accept even kind of like (gasp!shock!horror!) Gwen. I'm just trying to look at it from a storytelling POV. You know, trying to remove my personal feelings and see what they're attempting. Yeah, I'd rather see Janto... hell, we can just make it 24 hours of Janto and I'd be good (yes, that's known as pr0n, but it'd be uber-pretty pr0n!!! :grin:). But regardless of feelings towards Gwen and even her relationship with Rhys and how relateable it all is, she still phsyically brings us out of the TW world (by which I mean, the only time any of the other characters venture out, it's on a case or something... we get Gwen/Rhys scenes that are only drawn back into TW when TW interrupts and shatters the "normalcy" of it... that is, we can get scenes of the two of them unrelated to aliens and the like completely, you can forget about TW fully, and it could almost be a bad sitcom... no one else gives that to us).

[Noo]

Basically what PI said is what I also believe....

But just to add to Wooley's questioning of what Gareth says about Ianto. Because there was limited lines for Ianto in season 1, Gareth was able to give a lot more backstory as an actor by his actions and reactions. There has been a lot of information about what it is like on set and the actors are given a lot more ability to change lines / improvise than most other shows. One case in point is the line from Ianto in From Out of the Rain where Ianto alludes that he knows about the mental hospital. Originally there wasn't anything in the line, but Gareth suggested a change to allude to some mystery/knowledge. The writers and actors actually talk often is my understanding and no one has a handle on Ianto better than Gareth except for RTD. So I wouldn't dismiss what Gareth says as he is the one who really has changed / affected the character.

[clare616]

Staying well away from the lengthy (though interesting) debate...

Janto will go further in series 3, I'm certain of it because James Moran is writing 1 (or 2?) or the eps and he loves Janto... as shown by the BBCA blogs. Also I think that can ensure some more hilarious Ianto onliners :)

[torchwoody]

Oh that's good to hear Clare!

[nptorchwood]

I think i prefer to let my thoughts wonder than actually see the action (i covered my eyes the 1st time i saw that scene in Adrift!) so i dunno, swings and roundabouts really.

Id like to see Ianto and Gwen get into a life-threatening situation in S3 and see Jack fesses up about his feelings etc etc.

[ElectroxGirl]

(i covered my eyes the 1st time i saw that scene in Adrift!)

:lol: So did I!

[Aquila]

(i covered my eyes the 1st time i saw that scene in Adrift!)

:lol: So did I!
mine were glued to the screen! :laugh2:

[torchwoody]

mine were glued to the screen! :laugh2:

It's my screen saver!!

[Aquila]

mine were glued to the screen! :laugh2:

It's my screen saver!!
:good:

[Magicfire]

How can you close your eyes on that :omg:

[PoisonIvy]

I certainly didn't close my eyes. In fact, since I have to get it by "magic" (ie the interwebs) when I saw it, I looped it back and watched it a few times before I moved on.

[Aquila]

I certainly didn't close my eyes. In fact, since I have to get it by "magic" (ie the interwebs) when I saw it, I looped it back and watched it a few times before I moved on.
yeah, I don't want to admit how many times I watched it. That and the snog from ttlm, which I also have saved on my laptop as a slow motion animation. full screen. :blusher:

but seriously though, and back on subject. I totally think their relationship will move forward. I can't wait! :woot:

[Motherlessgoat]

With all indicators pointing that way - the public support of official production team reps, the DW inclusion, what has been spoken about by the actors concerning the script, the beefing up of Rhys in S3 - Janto won't be going away any time soon.

I know RTD likes to be perverse sometimes, but even he can't be deaf and blind to the tremendous international popularity of Torchwood. Would go so far as to predict an eclipseing of DW, at least here in the States. Nothing to sneeze at, for sure, and the positive portrayal of a same-sex relationship is a huge component of the show's ever expanding draw. (Doesn't hurt either that the two men are wildly attractive separately, and f*cking HOT together!) Can't see the same man that gave us schmooping Rose and the thrift store Doctor - that fan rallied for ending - screwing around with what broke the ground of his success.

Nor can the BBC be unaware of the show's audience demographics, they are the ones that pushed TW along the fast track to One, after all. Must give the Beeb props for placing such support behind a quirky, dark, GLBT inclusive and more often than not disturbed show like Torchwood. Would NEVER happen on American TV.

So, to sum up...Torchwood is a hit, Janto is popular, so their relationship will improve, grow stronger, become even more ingrained into TW's fabric, while not overshadowing the storylines. I hope.

And speaking of fabric, here's hoping we see some, if even just a shirt or two, smoothed off shoulders, slipping from fingertips, dropping to the floor to pool at Ianto's feet. *sigh*

[Aquila]

Doesn't hurt either that the two men are wildly attractive separately, and f*cking HOT together!

They are? I hadn't noticed. :tongue:

But yeah, I'm still wishfully dreaming for the bare ass bedroom scene I wrote...but I'll be happy with some suggestion and a bit of openess, yk? Otoh, I don't expect it when things are falling apart, but around Gwen and Rhys would be nice.

Good point about the Beeb...I totally think that Janto will come to an end (depending on how long the series runs) at some point, but as I said, I think it'll be Ianto's death that does it. I would love to be pleasantly surprised, but this is Torchwood after all, and we need to be realistic.

Oops, I lost my point. I meant to say that I agree...they are hardly going to toss the relationship aside after it's been established, practically for a season and a half, without having a very good reason.

[torchwoody]

... Would NEVER happen on American TV.
Isn't that the sad truth? :gaah:

[jantoskid]

[spoiler:3k4yzo0a]They have a new picture out for season 3 filming of jack and ianto sitting together talking. that's good? right?[/spoiler:3k4yzo0a]

[Aquila]

[spoiler:320j39ye]They have a new picture out for season 3 filming of jack and ianto sitting together talking. that's good? right?[/spoiler:320j39ye][spoiler:320j39ye]oh yes, it's brilliant. I can't wait to hear what they're saying...but it's just a nice moment, yk? yay.[/spoiler:320j39ye]

[torchwoody]

[spoiler:1tjywujq]From MissNoraHoadley's original post (http://torchwoodforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=70&t=6365):

[imgxl:1tjywujq]http://i421.photobucket.com/albums/pp292/MissNoraHoadley/filming2.jpg[/imgxl:1tjywujq]

Yes that's a very cute pic! :big_grin:[/spoiler:1tjywujq]

[blaid drwg]

[spoiler:2hjx18os]Do we definatly know that It's Jack and Ianto talking and not John and Gareth between takes? I really need to know that or I will be waiting to see it and be disapointed if it isnt in there.[/spoiler:2hjx18os]

[Cayendi]

[spoiler:3thf2h5c]Do we definatly know that It's Jack and Ianto talking and not John and Gareth between takes? I really need to know that or I will be waiting to see it and be disapointed if it isnt in there.[/spoiler:3thf2h5c][spoiler:3thf2h5c]After seeing the latest clip in the 'filming videos and pics' thread, I think it's John and Gareth, since I can't see any cameras, mikes or other filming utilities nearby ...
but I could be wrong[/spoiler:3thf2h5c]

[Aquila]

[spoiler:3b2fgax2]Do we definatly know that It's Jack and Ianto talking and not John and Gareth between takes? I really need to know that or I will be waiting to see it and be disapointed if it isnt in there.[/spoiler:3b2fgax2][spoiler:3b2fgax2]After seeing the latest clip in the 'filming videos and pics' thread, I think it's John and Gareth, since I can't see any cameras, mikes or other filming utilities nearby ...
but I could be wrong[/spoiler:3b2fgax2]
[spoiler:3b2fgax2]From what I could tell, they were filming...cause there were people all around them in some clips/pics (i've seen pics from another angle, where you could see the water tower) and then everyone clears out and it's just them...hold on, I'll try to find them...[/spoiler:3b2fgax2]

[Aquila]

[spoiler:2nq7pweh]K, in this pic, you can see the cameras on either side of them, and there's no one near...

[imgxl:2nq7pweh]http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w124/vivelesteve/08-09-08%20TW-%20Roald%20Dahl%20Plass/P9080922.jpg[/imgxl:2nq7pweh]

lots of back and forth in the video, but you see how they're filming, people around and it looks like they're getting set up, then not... www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAhFHoY4AqY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAhFHoY4AqY)
The video skips from place to place, but you can see it in snatches through out.

and damn, he looks good...

[imgxl:2nq7pweh]http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w124/vivelesteve/08-09-08%20TW-%20Roald%20Dahl%20Plass/P9080924.jpg[/imgxl:2nq7pweh][/spoiler:2nq7pweh]

[Noo]

[spoiler:1qojairz]It's definitely a scene between the two, it was reported on the DW Forum that it was an actual scene. No one could remember the dialogue though. They only heard bits and pieces of that one scene.[/spoiler:1qojairz]

[gottohavefaith]

could some one please give me the address of the DW Forum that you guys are talking about? Please?

[Aquila]

could some one please give me the address of the DW Forum that you guys are talking about? Please?http://www.doctorwhoforum.com/index.php

You'll have to get approved to join, but it didn't take very long. :good:

[nikkonekko]

I have faith that Janto will be advanced in series 3. Although it didn't start out as such, I think part of the reason for Janto is to provide contrast for Gwen/Rhys. Its the contrast between light and dark, life outside Torchwood and life inside Torchwood. That's why Gwen/Rhys is out in the open and Janto is discreet and subtextual. Its the reason that Ianto seems to know more of Jack's secrets than Gwen. Ianto is on the inside with Jack. Gwen, after making clear her alligience to Rhys in Meat remains outside.

[jAnToFoReVeR]

Nor can the BBC be unaware of the show's audience demographics, they are the ones that pushed TW along the fast track to One, after all. Must give the Beeb props for placing such support behind a quirky, dark, GLBT inclusive and more often than not disturbed show like Torchwood. Would NEVER happen on American TV.

They are doing the exact opposite here in Australia. Channel ten got series one and put it on 9.30pm for a while, then back to 9.40pm and then to MIDNIGHT from episode 8. We have only just recently gotten series two, but ten has put it on their HD channel, where it can only be accessed in selected capital cities at a very late timeslot. They keep shifting this series around as well. And of course, I don't live in a capital city and missing it is killing me! :cryin: You have no idea how many petitions I have signed! They seem to be underestimating the popularity of Torchwood and suppressing it. They aren't even advertising it! They use the excuse that there aren't many viewers, but maybe if they didn't shift the timeslot around and gave it a better one than midnight, they'd be surprised. I don't know why they are killing their own show, but that seems to be what they are doing! :cryin: 'TTLM' will be on this Monday and missing it is going to kill me.

[torchwoody]

Over in the Interviews forum, Noo just posted a great interview (http://torchwoodforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=6411) of GDL from celebritycloseups.com where he has a lot to say about Janto. If you'll forgive me quoting and cross posting, there's some relevant lines for this thread:


Part of what sets 'Torchwood' apart from 'Doctor Who' is the fluid sexuality of each of the characters, and the matter-of-fact same-sex relationship that Gareth's character, Ianto, enjoys with John Barrowman's Captain Jack Harkness.

The relationship has translated into a large gay fanbase for Gareth, including a spot on AfterElton.com's annual Hot 100 List. When I bring up the list, Gareth's eyes light up mischievously. "I did beat Brad Pitt and David Beckham. Just for the fucking record."

Not too shabby for a man who wasn't even on last year's list.

He's also very proud to be known as a gay icon, even though he's straight. "As a straight man, I'm just as flattered being a gay icon as I would be being a straight icon or whatever," he shrugs. "I'm of a mindset and philosophy that same sex relationships just aren't a fucking issue for me."

To his credit, he doesn't shy away from the subject; in fact, he's pretty passionate about making his opinion known. "It's not as much of an issue [in the U.K.] at all. I don't get it, I don't understand why it's controversial, I don't understand why it's anyone's business or why it becomes anyone's problem where you stick your dick," he states, with bracing candor. "Because it's not an issue for me, I don't really see us as pioneers. If we are viewed as pioneers, I just feel sorry for the people that are just coming 'round, because the wankers should have grown up much longer ago.

"There's nothing wrong with [two men kissing] and the fact that people are interested in [Jack and Ianto's] relationship – I'd like that to be because of the chemistry. That's the reason I want it to be popular, not because, oh my God, it's a SciFi show with a gay relationship. I know people are going to be like that, but because it's not an issue for me, I sort of haven't got time for people it is an issue for."

He's also quite content to let the writers determine Jack and Ianto's romantic future, whatever that may be: "I see the relationship very much sort of the way I deal with life... Let's just live every moment for now, because now might be all that you get. It's [the writers'] job to write the future of the characters, and I'm quite enjoying the fact that I don't know where it's going, and I'm enjoying the relationship onscreen and I'm enjoying the chemistry. Like any relationship when someone's happy, you want to stay with them as long as possible, but that doesn't always work out, which again is sort of why I'm like, they're there, they're together at the moment, enjoy it."

Hey Torchwood writers... TW is not a soap opera. Just because there's a happy relationship, you don't need to wreck it just to create drama. :acute: Especially this sort of relationship, IMO, which is such an anomaly. I think that tendency among tv writers is what GDL may be alluding to about the future.

[PoisonIvy]

I have faith that Janto will be advanced in series 3. Although it didn't start out as such, I think part of the reason for Janto is to provide contrast for Gwen/Rhys. Its the contrast between light and dark, life outside Torchwood and life inside Torchwood. That's why Gwen/Rhys is out in the open and Janto is discreet and subtextual. Its the reason that Ianto seems to know more of Jack's secrets than Gwen. Ianto is on the inside with Jack. Gwen, after making clear her alligience to Rhys in Meat remains outside.

You know, I think you just put into words something my brain was teetering on the edge of discovering for some time. Thank you!

Seriously, I've said some of this (the "why we are shown more Gwen/Rhys than Janto on the show" thing) in defence of the show as a whole, but the dichotomy you've juxtaposed is simply brilliant. You've pieced it all together and given my brain a happy whole (which, it must be noted, differs greatly from a "happy hole" :wink:). I feel somewhat complete suddenly.

Cheers! :drinks:

[Corana Jade]

In all honesty I dont really care. Theres more to the show than who's doing who. I know a lot of people are into that and each to their own. whether they keep the relationship or end it as long As long as its done right and tastefully.

[The doctor11]

dont know i just hope that its good!

[Phones_All_Broken]

Hi, newbie here. :blusher:

To be honest, I think they have no choice but to advance Janto, because with only five episodes I highly doubt that they're going to have time to end it satisfactorily (not that any end to Janto would be satisfactory, but you know what I mean). As people have said, the Janto relationship is clearly one of the biggest pull factors on the show, so as far as I'm concerned they'd be mad to get rid of it. They may well throw a big bundle of angst in, but I'm an angst junkie, so all angst is good angst to me unless it splits them up.

Also, I read somewhere that Jack and Ianto are going to have a 'relationship development' in series 3, and I was wondering if Jack might spend some time living in Ianto's flat, after the Hub has gone boom? Just an idea!

Billie x

[[Torchwood-Nerd]]

They'd better not get rid of the Janto relationship! I think if they did, they'd have a lot of angry fans on their hands. And the dynamics between Jack and Ianto as Jack tries to lead the team and deal with the fact that he'll outlive Ianto, while Ianto tries to find out if Jack really does feel for him and deal with the fact that there's so much about Jack he doesn't know, is an integral part of Torchwood, and they'd b crazy to take it out!

Plus, if they split up Jack and Ianto, they might end up attempting the Jack/Gwen angle again, which is something I really hope doesn't happen!

x

[Aquila]

]They'd better not get rid of the Janto relationship! I think if they did, they'd have a lot of angry fans on their hands. And the dynamics between Jack and Ianto as Jack tries to lead the team and deal with the fact that he'll outlive Ianto, while Ianto tries to find out if Jack really does feel for him and deal with the fact that there's so much about Jack he doesn't know, is an integral part of Torchwood, and they'd b crazy to take it out!

Plus, if they split up Jack and Ianto, they might end up attempting the Jack/Gwen angle again, which is something I really hope doesn't happen!

x
hear, hear. it seems certain that janto is moving forward in s3, woooo!

love your icon, btw. :grin:

I'll be controversial here and say the two best characters were written out of the series. Before y'all bite my head of I certainly can't imagine TW without Captain Jack BUT I think part of his 'charm' is the ability to be tender with anyone. I didn't read too much into his relationship with Ianto because he seemed to have other realtionships that were just as significant, if not more so.

I'm expecting him and Gwen to get closer.....

[51stCenturyFox]

Nor can the BBC be unaware of the show's audience demographics, they are the ones that pushed TW along the fast track to One, after all. Must give the Beeb props for placing such support behind a quirky, dark, GLBT inclusive and more often than not disturbed show like Torchwood. Would NEVER happen on American TV.

If it's after the watershed (what, 9pm) they can get away with more. Although really, we see less on Torchwood than on some films shown after the watershed.

In the US, I was really surprised the US show Swingtown had a whole season over the summer. It was a show set in the 70s sexual revolution in the suburbs period and there were a lot of complaints from puritans about it (I think I saw one real ad during the run with the rest being promos, since advertisers were afraid to touch it.)

Here, Torchwood is on cable/satellite, so it doesn't matter!

I agree with Aquila's rundown.

For the most part, I think that when a show's OTP - which for most viewers is Janto - gets all solidified and domestic, it does ruin the show. No excitement left. So I don't think they'll WRECK Janto but I don't think they'll be setting up house either. I also think Jack will continue to flirt with Gwen as well.

[Phones_All_Broken]

I agree, I don't think we'll be seeing any proposals and babies (although, as they said at Comic Con, series 6... :lol:) but I'm hoping that Janto may be moving more in the direction of them becoming an actual 'couple' as opposed to a 'thing'. But I don't for a second believe that Jack will *ever* stop flirting with *anyone*, least of all Gwen!

[emz.buckley]

I think they will move Janto forward in season 3. I could see it being either a, they are living together or b, they finally let their feelings for each other be known and possible I love you exchanged. :beg:

I think Janto is a perfect balance to gwen and rhys because it represents 2 different sides to TW. How to have a relationship on the outside and how to have one on the inside. Gwen shows the difficultly of having a normal life and marriage outside of TW, while those two show how hard it is to have a life inside it.

Will jack ever stop flirting with Gwen? Probably not. Its who Jack is and we have to deal with it. Lets not also forget that he flirts with the doctor and martha, along with the people on the outside. Jack is a flirty person by nature and i also think it might be a defense thing but that is my opinion.

[Phones_All_Broken]

For now, it's looking as though we are getting an improvement of some sorts, because the TW Magazine had an interview with Euros Lyn this week and he said:

[spoiler:225o21ss]'The love story between Captain Jack and Ianto continues to unfold, as does the story of married life for Gwen and Rhys, as Rhys's character comes into play a lot more, and he becomes almost the fourth member of the team, largely by accident.'[/spoiler:225o21ss]

To which all I can say is WOOT!! :woot:

[Stilyte]

Its good they use the words unfold....it gives the sense of progress rather than halting the relationship.
i think considering the third series takes place in a short place of time they would really have to continue the relationship. For it to end they would have to rush a storyline giving them problems and coming to an end and they wouldnt have the time to give it credit. Besides.....they work so well together they have to progess their relationship, its part of what keeps me watching.
I love what you said about the light and dark....think you hit the nail on the head there. it will be interesting to see if they give them many emotional moments or if they will continue with the one-liner moments...a combnation of both would be good.

i heard somewhere ianto's family might be involved...don't know if its true but could bring an interesting dynamic to it all!

[Meef]

The books seem to suggest more to Jack and Ianto's relationship. I don't think they would lead that way if they didn't intend for them to be together. We still don't know what Jack considers a relationship by 51st century standers. But how can you not love Ianto.

[Stilyte]

i agree that we still dont know exactly what the dating rituals are in the 51st century.... i mean in Captain John can like a poodle then anything is possible!

It would be nice if they can set the scene up more in this new season with more intimacy than just sex remarks, plus give us a hint as to Jack's point of view on the topic. I love the obviouse Janto moments in the books but doubt they would be that forward on screen!

[Undead Medic]

I think it would be good for Jack to have something other than Torchwood to keep him grounded, and to make him want to stick around. He has shown that he is dedicated to Torchwood and its cause, but I always got the feeling that he was restless, that he was maybe looking for something a little more permanent than what gratification his less emotional liaisons could offer. He has already shown that he is capable of falling for someone completely (Estelle, and his unnamed wife to name but two) and I think that a certain part of him is ready for that, but I think he is aware that he could easily end up hurting Ianto, and being immortal he eventually will lose him and I think that makes him cautious to allow himself the luxury.

In many respects there is a great parallel to be drawn between the Torchwood era Jack and the Doctor, both are unique in the universe, both are more or less guaranteed to outlive those they love, both are scared to admit to their feelings and are petrified of solitude, there is a conflicting volcano of emotion locked away inside both characters, an extremely self destructive pit of angst just threatening to explode forth.

I hope they explore the Jack/Ianto relationship further without sacrificing the integrity of the characters, keeping it easy on the schmaltz, keeping it real and honest to these two, each of whom comes laden with their own baggage...

Oh, and with plenty of Ianto one liners!

[Meef]

It would be nice to see the date they went on. They could show that on the show. So many other shows have personal life around the characters before they get into the plot or even around the plot. Bones does that a lot, so does House. Also it is time we learn Jack's past. Maybe telling it to Ianto after and intimate moment. That could be an episode in season four. After all Gwen gets all the out of Torchwood moments. They should show all them out of Torchwood.

[Undead Medic]

It would be nice to see the date they went on. They could show that on the show. So many other shows have personal life around the characters before they get into the plot or even around the plot. Bones does that a lot, so does House. Also it is time we learn Jack's past. Maybe telling it to Ianto after and intimate moment. That could be an episode in season four. After all Gwen gets all the out of Torchwood moments. They should show all them out of Torchwood.

So long as they don't turn it into a Soap opera, they'd have to be careful...

[Aquila]

I think it would be good for Jack to have something other than Torchwood to keep him grounded, and to make him want to stick around. He has shown that he is dedicated to Torchwood and its cause, but I always got the feeling that he was restless, that he was maybe looking for something a little more permanent than what gratification his less emotional liaisons could offer. He has already shown that he is capable of falling for someone completely (Estelle, and his unnamed wife to name but two) and I think that a certain part of him is ready for that, but I think he is aware that he could easily end up hurting Ianto, and being immortal he eventually will lose him and I think that makes him cautious to allow himself the luxury.

In many respects there is a great parallel to be drawn between the Torchwood era Jack and the Doctor, both are unique in the universe, both are more or less guaranteed to outlive those they love, both are scared to admit to their feelings and are petrified of solitude, there is a conflicting volcano of emotion locked away inside both characters, an extremely self destructive pit of angst just threatening to explode forth.

I hope they explore the Jack/Ianto relationship further without sacrificing the integrity of the characters, keeping it easy on the schmaltz, keeping it real and honest to these two, each of whom comes laden with their own baggage...

Oh, and with plenty of Ianto one liners!
Totally. :big_grin: It will be very interesting to watch. :scared011:

[Banshee]

I think it would be good for Jack to have something other than Torchwood to keep him grounded, and to make him want to stick around. He has shown that he is dedicated to Torchwood and its cause, but I always got the feeling that he was restless, that he was maybe looking for something a little more permanent than what gratification his less emotional liaisons could offer. He has already shown that he is capable of falling for someone completely (Estelle, and his unnamed wife to name but two) and I think that a certain part of him is ready for that, but I think he is aware that he could easily end up hurting Ianto, and being immortal he eventually will lose him and I think that makes him cautious to allow himself the luxury.

In many respects there is a great parallel to be drawn between the Torchwood era Jack and the Doctor, both are unique in the universe, both are more or less guaranteed to outlive those they love, both are scared to admit to their feelings and are petrified of solitude, there is a conflicting volcano of emotion locked away inside both characters, an extremely self destructive pit of angst just threatening to explode forth.

I hope they explore the Jack/Ianto relationship further without sacrificing the integrity of the characters, keeping it easy on the schmaltz, keeping it real and honest to these two, each of whom comes laden with their own baggage...

Oh, and with plenty of Ianto one liners!

:yes: Agreed :yes: :grin:

[libraryelf]

I hope they show a little more of them being together, walking around talking about things. In "Adam", I noticed that Jack was getting ready to go out and there was Ianto in the corner after being "mind raped" and Jack notices him and just before Ianto spoke, Jack's expression was "Oh, no. Not now.." I think he just wanted go out and have beer and maybe a one night stand. But as we know, he went after Adam and didn't stop until Adam was and the memory erased. I think Jack likes to have one night stands, but if Ianto did that, we viewers as fly on wall we are, would see either very loud and ugly fight or quiet, cold menancing fight. Jack being loud, and Ianto being quiet. Also they are together so much of the time, they might start getting on each others nerves. Sometimes to much being together is a bad thing. That might be why Ianto still has his apartment/house (we still don't know where he lives). Sometimes they might need some nights apart. Sorry for typos. :hmm:

[Starbuck]

Libraryelf Just came across your post and just wanted to correct you if you're referring to Adam in series 2 then actually Jack was just returning to the hub after weevil hunting on his own where Jack had a strange encounter Adam who helps him go back and 'remember' his past as Adam tells Jack he is the one Jack talks to.

Jack then returns to the hub to discover Ianto its finding Ianto in that state which leads to Adam finally being revealed. As for the dynamics of the relationship I am interested in seeing how it develops during series 3 and if it agrees with my thoughts regarding there relationship.

[Aquila]

I hope they show a little more of them being together, walking around talking about things. In "Adam", I noticed that Jack was getting ready to go out and there was Ianto in the corner after being "mind raped" and Jack notices him and just before Ianto spoke, Jack's expression was "Oh, no. Not now.." I think he just wanted go out and have beer and maybe a one night stand. But as we know, he went after Adam and didn't stop until Adam was and the memory erased. I think Jack likes to have one night stands, but if Ianto did that, we viewers as fly on wall we are, would see either very loud and ugly fight or quiet, cold menancing fight. Jack being loud, and Ianto being quiet. Also they are together so much of the time, they might start getting on each others nerves. Sometimes to much being together is a bad thing. That might be why Ianto still has his apartment/house (we still don't know where he lives). Sometimes they might need some nights apart. Sorry for typos. :hmm:
Interesting. You've already been corrected on the Adam sequence, but what in canon makes you think Jack drinks beer (he never has, during TW) and shags random people for fun?

And why would it be okay for Jack to do it, but not Ianto? Given the 51st/21st century views, it would be the other way around, if anything.

Of course, I don't have the view of their relationship you seem to...

[Roqui]

they better not wreck it! :scared: Janto is one of the best things in TW. :inlove:

[Meef]

You should read the new books. There are a lot of cute moments between the two.

[Stilyte]

Agreed some great moments...finished almost perfect and just at the zoo in pack animals.
i do like how they incluse the Janto into the sotries. It gives me much more hope for the thrid series.

[Meef]

I think I liked the last 3 books the best.

[emz.buckley]

I didn't see that scene from Adam like that at all. I saw it more as, when Ianto said Jack and he stopped, he thought it was someone from his memory talking to him, like his father did when he was chasing the weevil. And he swung round to see who it was and discovered it was Ianto and was more relieved that it was only Ianto and not someone from his past. Also, the whole 'hey' part i put down to him trying to act like nothing was wrong and he wasn't seeing people from his past, probably because he didn't want to share it with anyone, a. because they would think he is nuts and b. because they didn't know about his past and he didn't want to have explain it. Jack isn't the most open person about his past so at that moment in time and depending on whether or not in that episode they were a couple or Adam had changed it, we don't know and can only guess how much Jack had told ianto at that point. But i put it down to the situation with Adam into why Jack reacted like that and i also get the feeling that he had just come in from standing on the roof
and brooding over what had happened on the weevil hunt and probably had alot going on in his mind by the time he had reached the hub, seeing dead people or people from your memories isn't something you tend to tell people. To paraphrase a Harry Potter line, even in Torchwood hearing voice isn't a good sign.

[temporalwitch]

I didn't see that scene from Adam like that at all. I saw it more as, when Ianto said Jack and he stopped, he thought it was someone from his memory talking to him, like his father did when he was chasing the weevil. And he swung round to see who it was and discovered it was Ianto and was more relieved that it was only Ianto and not someone from his past. Also, the whole 'hey' part i put down to him trying to act like nothing was wrong and he wasn't seeing people from his past, probably because he didn't want to share it with anyone, a. because they would think he is nuts and b. because they didn't know about his past and he didn't want to have explain it. Jack isn't the most open person about his past so at that moment in time and depending on whether or not in that episode they were a couple or Adam had changed it, we don't know and can only guess how much Jack had told ianto at that point. But i put it down to the situation with Adam into why Jack reacted like that and i also get the feeling that he had just come in from standing on the roof
and brooding over what had happened on the weevil hunt and probably had alot going on in his mind by the time he had reached the hub, seeing dead people or people from your memories isn't something you tend to tell people. To paraphrase a Harry Potter line, even in Torchwood hearing voice isn't a good sign.
The most interesting thing about "Adam" to me was that, even though Adam had mucked with both Gwen's and Jack's memories, Jack hadn't the impetus to investigate it until Adam hurt Ianto. Had Adam left Ianto alone, he might have gotten by with his coercion a while longer.

[Meef]

I think they should have tied Adam into the whole Grey thing. It would have made more sense . Other wise the whole story kind of showed no purpose except to let us know how close Jack and Ianto have become. That could have been done anywhere. If Jack could have confided in Ianto about his passed and they figured out Adam was behind it. Instead, Adam messes with Ianto and brings about his own destruction.

[Jack-Ianto88]

You should read the new books. There are a lot of cute moments between the two.

Hi, i was just wondering which books had the Janto relationship/moments in them. I just ordered "Almost Perfect" and "The Twilight Streets" I mean don't get me wrong, i want to get ALL the torchwood books but since i am a HUGE Jack/Ianto fan, i would like to get all the books with them/their relationship in them first.

Also, i do/hope they continue the Janto in Series 3. I'm not going to lie, i originally started watching the show because of the Janto. A friend of mine emailed me about a month ago and told me about this tv show that has gay characters/couple in it and sent me a link where i could watch an episode online. It was adrift and when i saw the Jack/Ianto "office" scene, i was hooked. Don't get me wrong, i love the show for the show, but i originally gave it a chance because of Janto. So i'm not going to say that i won't watch it if the Janto isn't furthered or even dropped, but if it was, i'd be extremely pissed/upset.

Sorry. lol. but yeah personally, they'd be stupid to stop the Janto. they'd have a mob scene on their hands. and i seen "The Stolen Earth" and "Journey's End" They wouldn't (or at least i would think) put the Jack/Ianto scene (even tho it was small) in there if they weren't going to continue it in series 3.

[Aquila]

Hi Ray. Welcome to the board. :hello:

If you're looking for Janto in the books, the later ones are the ones with the most, just as the later episodes (all of s2, really) have more. Twilight Streets, Trace Memory, Almost Perfect, Pack Animals, and Skypoint are all post s1 and include Janto in varying degrees. :D Plus there are 3 books due out in May and 3 due in October that will all follow the direction we were pointed in by s2 and soon, s3.

And don't worry, the Janto is not going anywhere. We've been told about s3 that 'the love story between Jack and Ianto will continue to unfold' and that their relationship will develop and they will grow closer. Same goes with Gwen/Rhys. Gwack? What's that?

[Jack-Ianto88]

oh ok. thanks for the book info, lol. and yeah i have faith that we will definitely get our Janto :)

[Phones_All_Broken]

The most Janto-filled books imo are Pack Animals and Twilight Streets, with Almost Perfect running a close second. Pack Animals is more fluffy, whilst AP gets more angsty and focusses on different areas of their relationship. And Twilight Streets is just cute. :smile:

[Stilyte]

i have to agree...i'd have enjoyed those books just for the janto moments alone.
I don't take the books as canon but if they're a rough guide as to how the relationship will develop on screen then i'm looking forward to the new series.

[RisenMitten]

My sis is getting me Pack Animals for my birthday next week, can't WAIT :yahoo1:

[Jack-Ianto88]

hey thanks for the information. i just got done reading both of the books i ordered (Almost Perfect and The Twilight Streets) this weekend and they were amazing. I'm ordering Pack Animals now and can't wait to dive into that one.

[Torchwoodx]

Almost Perfect is awesome, i bought it last weekend and finished it in one day :omg:
Can't wait for more new ones :dance123:

[Jack-Ianto88]

judging by the trailer, it doesn't look like they plan on wrecking Janto....to which i am extremely grateful.

[Clarrisani]

Agreed. It looks like they're setting it in concrete. *ducks flying sharp objects*

[Noo]

Agreed. It looks like they're setting it in concrete. *ducks flying sharp objects*

*boom, tish*

[Jack-Ianto88]

Agreed. It looks like they're setting it in concrete. *ducks flying sharp objects*

*boom, tish*

Lol. i was going to say that the Jack/Ianto relationship looks like it's set in stone lol. but hey, concrete works better lol. but yeah, after seeing the trailer, i am confident we will definitely get our Janto. Although i can't stop watching the damn thing. they need to hurry up and give us our Children of Earth!

[Aquila]

judging by the trailer, it doesn't look like they plan on wrecking Janto....to which i am extremely grateful.
hear, hear.

[Aquila]

Agreed. It looks like they're setting it in concrete. *ducks flying sharp objects*
Hell yes. It's not going anywhere. :dance123:

[Torchwoodx]

Agreed. It looks like they're setting it in concrete. *ducks flying sharp objects*
Hell yes. It's not going anywhere. :dance123:
WOOO!
I can't wait for Series 3 now :grin:

[time_vortex]

I dont think they can ruin Janto.... Just give us more janto and i will be happy

even if they like break up it would be awesome angst ridden janto.

[Meef]

I agree Time_vortex angst ridden Janto would be a good thing.

[time_vortex]

Angst is always a good thing Meef, well, in TV at least (real life angst isnt that awesome)

And with Janto angst there will be sexual tension and a means to get them back together because they can't stand to be apart.

[nikkonekko]

Spoilers have me worried. Does anyone think TW is about to undergo a scorched earth revision so Gwack TW can become a vehicle for TPTB to explore post-watershed story lines they couldn’t do on Who. If they wreck Janto and go down to two leads we get the Whovian trilogy of “immortal male with female-side kick plus neglected love interest, only post-watershed.

I also get the impression from various interviews that RTD is particularly effusive about JB and EM. He says very nice things about the entire cast, but he is particularly effusive about these two. Saying that these parts were created especially for them. Do you think he is looking to structure the show to showcase these characters? Sort of like a kid who wants to play only with his favorite toys?

Reason for Edit: Sorry, typo making it gibberish.

[Meef]

nikkonekko, that is a very valid point! Spoilers and interviews have always been in my experience away of masking the truth about what is really going to happen in a show. At times RTD and company have been very miss leading.Then all of a sudden a major spoiler is leaked. What I've learned about this show is that JB and EM characters are the focal point. Ianto was suppose to have been killed off. But RTD decided no on that. RTD changing his mind is known to happen. He has the power to do it. Also he is a kid playing with his favorite toys.( Nikko I like this image you used). This is his universe in the show. DW was someone else that he built from. That is probably why you will never see DW in a Torchwood Ep. Though I would like it. I think to say that Janto as a done deal is a false assumption. The show isn't over yet. So there is always going to be change. I would love to see Janto more. But if they design it right, it could be and interesting ride to get there.

[time_vortex]

i was listening to an interview with Euros Lynn (who is directing season 3) and he said that Janto get a good bit of attention in Children of Earth, so I don't think that its going anywhere anytime soon. RTD has written for shows like "Queer as Folk" so he doesn't have a problem with gay plot lines but he might feel that the tension between Jack and Gwen is more pronounced. I don't think he wants to go down a Doctor/Rose root but he wants to keep it an option. He also kind of shot Gwack down because of the Rhys/Gwen marriage thing and wants to show Gwen as a person who has a life outside Torchwood, unlike Jack or Ianto.

[AutumnRose]

I think Euros Lynn said Jack/Ianto was an integeral part to series 3! YAY! Although, it does probably mean angst - but y'know anything with those two is good.

[Meef]

As I've stated before angst is always good! Nothing wrong with a couple taking the long way home. A good romance always has angst. I would be disappointed if Janto was made easy.

[Iantofan4557]

I think for series 3 they have no choice but to improve ianto since he is so popular. And they already extended on the character in series 2 after series 1, so they need to do the same for series 3. I for one certainly want to see more from Ianto. If the BBC were to wreck ianto, it would, as other people have previously mentioned, cause uproar. It would be the biggest mistake the BBC ever made. But the trailer looks promising, so I think that there will be more from ianto in Children of Earth. I shall look forward to it. :smile:

[Acirederf+]

Tw is a show that through all it's awesome Sci-fi, lovely(appearance wise) characters and addictive - catchy one liners also has an element of extreme brutality.

Where DW has the cushioning of a at least partially happy ending or at the very least some 'watery' consolation, Torchwood reflects reality in it's most raw and savagely realistic form.

'Faries at the bottom of the garden' is a prime example of the complete and utter destruction of one woman’s life. Daughter, fiancé, pregnant, it's a seemingly perfect scenario and yet in one horrible second (even more vile is the notion that this all happend around her for reasons beyond her control) it all crumbles before her.

She is left alone: her lover and her child dead (or 'fairyafied') and fated to be a single parent.

Left to survive and break in loneliness.

This ruthless thread of reality is weaved consistently through the entirety of Torchwood. The sad but unfortunately commonly applicable notion of 'No happy endings' is key to the Torchwood dynamic.

Not just in the nature of their work, but in the nature of the torchwood relationships as well.

The relationships within Torchwood (or at least those that effect Janto)

Gwack (Gwen X Jack) : New girl (Gwen) is rescued from her ordinary life, by some mysterious and dashing hero. Jack. Gwen is intrigued by Jack, but also resentful of his callous and hard exterior - similarly Jack is not only dazzled, but also incensed by this tenacious and empathetic girl.

A sexual tension builds between the two and slowly Gwen begins to fall in love with Jack - the hard headed yet lovable hero. Her knight in shining armour - and guess what?

Prince charming lets her do it.

But still Gwen has missed something. Because Gwen only see's Jack for what she want's to believe.

For what he want's her to believe.

Gwen never notices the chink in Jacks armour.

But Ianto does.

(Janto) Jack X Ianto -

Ianto doesn't see Jack in the same way Gwen does. Ianto see's the pain, the fear and the loneliness that Jack is slowly beginning to internalize in.
He see's the compassion in Jack. Where Gwen it too arrogant 'You don't understand. None of you..." he brings out the softness. Ianto drives wedges of humanity into the cracks of Jacks heroic facade. He slowly breaks it down. And Jack begins to help him do it.

Finally someone see's Jack in his real light. Of course there are still elements of heroism, that is after all a fundamental part of Jacks character - but with the heroism also comes all the other strengths and weakness that make up Jack.

Ianto can see Jacks more tender faults. But that’s what he loves about him.

On the other hand Jack, whilst approaching Gwen with his ' Prince charming meets Casa - Nova' act - out of the corner of his eye there’s always someone else -

Ianto. (This is apparent from 'fragments' in Iantos flash back with the pterodactyl. Just the way the looked at each other whilst on the ground. It made me shiver)

And of course, this being Torchwood, the shy but handsome tea boy is not all he seems.

‘Insert dramatic ‘Cyberwoman episode’

Ianto is left broken by the death of Liza and the events of canary wolf, Jack notices this internal devastation and he ‘empathizes’ with it. He begins to make an effort, he tries to get to know Ianto.

I have no doubt that Ianto after the recent emotional trauma, as well as being a seemingly very personal guy has a couple of barriers himself. But Jack breaks through them, and at the same time Ianto without knowing how manages to break through some of his.

A relationship begins to form.

Probably not a romantic one at first, but there is now a bond. A bond of mutual understanding. Slowly the bond begins to build, each one becoming a means of understanding for the other. Not only understanding but compassion. Ianto gets through to Jack on levels that no one else seems to be able to. Around Ianto the ‘Confident Captain Jack’ is softer, gentler - and this isn’t just a mask he put’s on for Ianto sake. This is the real Captain Jack.

Ianto is the one that brings out Jacks true, inner nature - just as Jack is the one who give Ianto support and meaning.

Evidence such as that delicate yet intense kiss on the forehead in ‘Adam’ and Iantos speech about how Jack kept him going.

That’s when you see the true, loving nature of their relationship. No guards or faces (I always get the feeling with Jack and Gwen that he’s showing her what she want’s to see and she’s refusing to look past it.) just them together and complete trust.

Gwack - The fairytale relationship that everyone wants. Normal girl gets swept of her feet by a mysterious stranger…blah blah blah *teenage girl squee*

Janto - Reality. Coupled with all the horror, the foul truth of how everything can be taken in an instant, is the very thing that we fear being taken away.

Showing how with all the magnified badness in life, is the pure and undying goodness.

The intensity and depth of the Janto relationship and what it brings out in each of them. How they not only accept, but learn to love each others faults, how they support and lean upon each other.

How they show that reality can be far FAR more beautiful than any fairytale.

And why Jack X Ianto just HAS to continue in season 3.


(Note: I love Gwen. I honestly do - she is very human. Kind, but also selfish and just laced in delicious faults. And I tend to think that whilst Gwen and Jack have a very blurred relationship - only seeing what they want to - her and Rhys(who I also LOVE) rely on each other, in a way not dissimilar to that of Jack and Ianto.)

I'm new to the forum :blusher: Please reply and tell me what you think of my Janto views ^^

Thanksxxx

[Noo]

Welcome Acriderf+

That is what I love about the Jack and Ianto relationship, that both men can actually see the real person that they both try and hide from most others. They can relax and be mostly themselves (I'm sure there are still a lot of secrets yet to be revealed about both).

Both Euros and Gareth have talked up the Jack/Ianto relationship. Especially Euros, when he has taken pains to redirect a Gwack question into a janto one shows you the direction that will be taken in Series 3. The most recent books are all indicative of the pairings being Jack/Ianto and Gwen/Rhys.

There is a lot of drama and interest still to be explored with those relationships. I love that about the show, that they don't presume that things end perfectly just because someone is in a relationship or they got married. Life doesn't end at the white picket fence ideal, it keeps going on.

[nikkonekko]

Acirederf+, your Gwack vis a vis Janto nails it down tight. Not a wobble. Thanks.

Yes, I've always thought Gwack was fairly tale teenage love while Janto was a steady fire the will keep you warm through thick, thin and old age.

[Meef]

They have tons of room for improving Janto. I want it to move slowly though. Most romance are ruined if the pace is accelerated. Slow is better.

[Acirederf+]

Acirederf+, your Gwack vis a vis Janto nails it down tight. Not a wobble. Thanks.

Yes, I've always thought Gwack was fairly tale teenage love while Janto was a steady fire the will keep you warm through thick, thin and old age.

Thankyou ^^ :hello:
Not to offend anyone but I've always thought that Gwack was aimed at a younger audience, just because of the lack of experience they've (presumably) had in Romance (my 13 year old cousin being a prime example) the only knowledge they have to base relationships off, is what they may have seen in romantic movies and such. The same goes for sex. Most people aged 10 – 15 wont have reached that level of intimacy with someone, the still have a very idealized view of what it’s supposed to be like and that would account for how many of them seem to feel that Janto is little more than ‘lust’.
Living proof of this is the overwhelming popularity of the Twilight novels. The 'dashing hero whisk me of my feet cliché' is very popular and that's why Gwack attracts (or I theorize it to attract :blusher: ) lot's of the adolescent audience. They want to be Gwen. They want to be rescued from their mundane lives and to fall devastatingly in love with the person that does it. And that's why they miss Janto. Because Janto it's not just about Jack rescuing Ianto.
It's about them supporting and rescuing eachover.
Of course there is the fact that Jack is (supposedly) a bit of a ‘manwhore’, but episodes such as ‘Adam’ and ‘they keep killing Suzie’ show that Jack does have deep and real feelings for Ianto. Feelings that could never be considered ‘**** buddies’ or just pure lust. Lust is a factor (it has to be for any relationship to work) but there is definitely something more powerful beneath the surface.
And the older more, romantically mature audience see the beauty and the realism in what's happening between them (although actually I can't really refer to my self as being romantically mature. But I've had enough experience to empathize with the two different scenarios.)

Hehe^^ Sorry I get lost in rant occasionally

[kolo]

Not to offend anyone but I've always thought that Gwack was aimed at a younger audience, just because of the lack of experience they've (presumably) had in Romance (my 13 year old cousin being a prime example) the only knowledge they have to base relationships off, is what they may have seen in romantic movies and such. The same goes for sex. Most people aged 10 – 15 wont have reached that level of intimacy with someone, the still have a very idealized view of what it’s supposed to be like and that would account for how many of them seem to feel that Janto is little more than ‘lust’.

Although I'm not really that into Janto or the whole "Janto vs Gwack" thing, I totally agree with what you have just said.

[Acirederf+]

I w
Welcome Acriderf+

That is what I love about the Jack and Ianto relationship, that both men can actually see the real person that they both try and hide from most others. They can relax and be mostly themselves (I'm sure there are still a lot of secrets yet to be revealed about both).

Both Euros and Gareth have talked up the Jack/Ianto relationship. Especially Euros, when he has taken pains to redirect a Gwack question into a janto one shows you the direction that will be taken in Series 3. The most recent books are all indicative of the pairings being Jack/Ianto and Gwen/Rhys.

There is a lot of drama and interest still to be explored with those relationships. I love that about the show, that they don't presume that things end perfectly just because someone is in a relationship or they got married. Life doesn't end at the white picket fence ideal, it keeps going on.

I completely agree ^^

Is it just me or were the last three books (particually The Twilight Streets and Almost perfect the most in character and well written of the saga) Of course that may just be my Janto biased speaking. It gets out somtimes XD

[Acirederf+]

Not to offend anyone but I've always thought that Gwack was aimed at a younger audience, just because of the lack of experience they've (presumably) had in Romance (my 13 year old cousin being a prime example) the only knowledge they have to base relationships off, is what they may have seen in romantic movies and such. The same goes for sex. Most people aged 10 – 15 wont have reached that level of intimacy with someone, the still have a very idealized view of what it’s supposed to be like and that would account for how many of them seem to feel that Janto is little more than ‘lust’.

Although I'm not really that into Janto or the whole "Janto vs Gwack" thing, I totally agree with what you have just said.

Thanyou ^^

And i've seen you moderating on several Gwack/Janto forums, with all the hassle you get from it, i'm suprised you don't despise both of the fandoms intensly.

I think i better stop commenting on this forum topic, i've had like the last three posts, which is pretty awful :blusher:

[kolo]

Thanyou ^^

And i've seen you moderating on several Gwack/Janto forums, with all the hassle you get from it, i'm suprised you don't despise both of the fandoms intensly.



Oh believe me, I've been close.

[time_vortex]

Acirederf+, your analysis was perfect. It brought out the cliche almost attraction between gwen and jack and the more real life, and believable attraction between Jack and Ianto. The plot line is also more interesting because it is so subtle and unknown. We don't see a lot of Janto, but enough to know that it is happening. Gwack is what is expected, but Janto is what is happening.

((Janto FTW))

[AutumnRose]

I wouldn't call myself 'romantically mature', but I do think that part of what attracts me to Jack/Ianto is the whole it's Ianto who looks after Jack for a change. I like how with every other person in the Whoniverse it's Jack who waltzes into their life and they get flustered/freaked when he saves them. But with Ianto, it was him who saved Jack from the weevil the very first time they met (although I do have a theory that Ianto set that up so he run in and save him). Jack didn't have to be the dashing hero when they met.

With Gwack, I think Gwen doesn't actually see Jack for he who is. From Adrift, you get the feeling that she doesn't really understand him at all. She hero worships him. But with Ianto, who was running rings around Jack from the first time they met, he is fully aware of Jack's flaws and weakness, and likewise, Jack has seen Ianto as low as he can get. Ianto never gets caught up in the bravado that is Captain Jack Harkness and I think thats what Jack loves about him. That he really knows him. I don't mean that he knows every little detail from his past, but more who he is now, his habits, his quirks etc.

So yeah, whilst I don't want to see them getting engaged, or setting up house together, I want tender moments. Moments which show the depth of their feelings for each other. But also I want issues, I want angst. Whilst I'd like them to be completely sussed in thier relationship, I want to see them get there first. But I know when they both figure out what it is they want from the other, and they are both getting it, then something terrible and tragic will happen to Ianto. Because TV is evil like that. :googly1:

Oh, and ofcourse, I never want them to stop flirting. :blusher: I don't want Jack to stop flirting with anyone!

[Jack-Ianto88]

I wouldn't call myself 'romantically mature', but I do think that part of what attracts me to Jack/Ianto is the whole it's Ianto who looks after Jack for a change. I like how with every other person in the Whoniverse it's Jack who waltzes into their life and they get flustered/freaked when he saves them. But with Ianto, it was him who saved Jack from the weevil the very first time they met (although I do have a theory that Ianto set that up so he run in and save him). Jack didn't have to be the dashing hero when they met.

With Gwack, I think Gwen doesn't actually see Jack for he who is. From Adrift, you get the feeling that she doesn't really understand him at all. She hero worships him. But with Ianto, who was running rings around Jack from the first time they met, he is fully aware of Jack's flaws and weakness, and likewise, Jack has seen Ianto as low as he can get. Ianto never gets caught up in the bravado that is Captain Jack Harkness and I think thats what Jack loves about him. That he really knows him. I don't mean that he knows every little detail from his past, but more who he is now, his habits, his quirks etc.

So yeah, whilst I don't want to see them getting engaged, or setting up house together, I want tender moments. Moments which show the depth of their feelings for each other. But also I want issues, I want angst. Whilst I'd like them to be completely sussed in thier relationship, I want to see them get there first. But I know when they both figure out what it is they want from the other, and they are both getting it, then something terrible and tragic will happen to Ianto. Because TV is evil like that. :googly1:

Oh, and ofcourse, I never want them to stop flirting. :blusher: I don't want Jack to stop flirting with anyone!

I was with you up until you said that didn't want them to get engaged or set up house together. I would love to see a more domestic side to Janto. Them waking up together, idk, speaking as a gay male, i would like to see that because most movies portray us homosexuals as man whores and that is so not the case. i mean sure, there are some of us, but most of us just want a partner to be with for pretty much the rest of our lives. and i want to see that with Jack and Ianto. i do want more flirting and tender moments, but i don't see why they can't have tender moments and be domestic at the same time.

[Aquila]

Acirederf+, your Gwack vis a vis Janto nails it down tight. Not a wobble. Thanks.

Yes, I've always thought Gwack was fairly tale teenage love while Janto was a steady fire the will keep you warm through thick, thin and old age.
I second this. Great post, Acirederf...and way to summarize, nikko. :happy:

[Aquila]

Not to offend anyone but I've always thought that Gwack was aimed at a younger audience, just because of the lack of experience they've (presumably) had in Romance (my 13 year old cousin being a prime example) the only knowledge they have to base relationships off, is what they may have seen in romantic movies and such. The same goes for sex. Most people aged 10 – 15 wont have reached that level of intimacy with someone, the still have a very idealized view of what it’s supposed to be like and that would account for how many of them seem to feel that Janto is little more than ‘lust’.

Although I'm not really that into Janto or the whole "Janto vs Gwack" thing, I totally agree with what you have just said.
I agree with both of you.

But then, when don't I agree with Amy? :lust:

[Aquila]

I wouldn't call myself 'romantically mature', but I do think that part of what attracts me to Jack/Ianto is the whole it's Ianto who looks after Jack for a change. I like how with every other person in the Whoniverse it's Jack who waltzes into their life and they get flustered/freaked when he saves them. But with Ianto, it was him who saved Jack from the weevil the very first time they met (although I do have a theory that Ianto set that up so he run in and save him). Jack didn't have to be the dashing hero when they met.

With Gwack, I think Gwen doesn't actually see Jack for he who is. From Adrift, you get the feeling that she doesn't really understand him at all. She hero worships him. But with Ianto, who was running rings around Jack from the first time they met, he is fully aware of Jack's flaws and weakness, and likewise, Jack has seen Ianto as low as he can get. Ianto never gets caught up in the bravado that is Captain Jack Harkness and I think thats what Jack loves about him. That he really knows him. I don't mean that he knows every little detail from his past, but more who he is now, his habits, his quirks etc.

So yeah, whilst I don't want to see them getting engaged, or setting up house together, I want tender moments. Moments which show the depth of their feelings for each other. But also I want issues, I want angst. Whilst I'd like them to be completely sussed in thier relationship, I want to see them get there first. But I know when they both figure out what it is they want from the other, and they are both getting it, then something terrible and tragic will happen to Ianto. Because TV is evil like that.

Oh, and ofcourse, I never want them to stop flirting. :blusher: I don't want Jack to stop flirting with anyone!
Again, I totally agree. I'd love to see Jack and Ianto working through some angst and issues but staying together because they are so well suited, not to mention the whole being in love thing. :tongue:



I was with you up until you said that didn't want them to get engaged or set up house together. I would love to see a more domestic side to Janto. Them waking up together, idk, speaking as a gay male, i would like to see that because most movies portray us homosexuals as man whores and that is so not the case. i mean sure, there are some of us, but most of us just want a partner to be with for pretty much the rest of our lives. and i want to see that with Jack and Ianto. i do want more flirting and tender moments, but i don't see why they can't have tender moments and be domestic at the same time.
Yeah, but there's a line where it has to fit with the characters. I'd love, love some domestic moments between them, I want those little moments that show them as a couple not just as work partners. But the 'setting up house' thing is just pushing the cliche, and fits more into the Gwack dream than the Janto reality. It would be wonderful, it just needs to be done true to the characters and not any cookie cutter fantasy. :D

Otoh, I did write a fic based on that domesticity. Well, it started that way and morphed into sex games. Damn those boys for turning my mind to smut. :blusher:

And honestly, stereotypes piss me off. Gay straight, bi...promiscuity is not good, but orientation has nothing to do with it. It' s a personal thing. :wink: My guess is that gay men have that stereotype because men in general have that stereotype, and without a woman to 'tame' him (I think I just sprained my eyes rolling them with such ferocity...) he'll run wild. Let's open our minds, shall we, people?

[AutumnRose]

Yeah, but there's a line where it has to fit with the characters. I'd love, love some domestic moments between them, I want those little moments that show them as a couple not just as work partners. But the 'setting up house' thing is just pushing the cliche, and fits more into the Gwack dream than the Janto reality. It would be wonderful, it just needs to be done true to the characters and not any cookie cutter fantasy.

The only way it would work is if Ianto moved into the Hub, 'cos Jack can't leave it. I'd love to see them wake up together! (I have a scene in my head where Ianto is squicked at using jack's toothbrush and Jack's all 'but last night you had your tongue on my ...' :blusher:')

Anywho, I don't think the show needs another domesticated relationship. Gwen and Rhys are more suited to domesticty because Rhys isn't part of Torchwood. In series 2, Jack/Ianto is compared to Gwen/Rhys and I hope in series 3 we see how hard it is for Gwen to have a relationship with somone outside, and that it is no easier for Jack and Ianto to have a relationship on the inside. I don't think we'll get a huge amount of domestic scenes, but I think that Jack and Ianto are a non sterotypical gay relationship as they are in a loving and commited relationship. For all of Jack's flirting, he very rarely acts upon it. If you watch, he waits for Ianto to make all the moves. I think their relationship is very postive and non sterotypical without having to be domesticated.

Kinda tired when I wrote that - hope it makes sense! :sleeping:

[51stCenturyFox]

Yeah, but there's a line where it has to fit with the characters. I'd love, love some domestic moments between them, I want those little moments that show them as a couple not just as work partners. But the 'setting up house' thing is just pushing the cliche, and fits more into the Gwack dream than the Janto reality. It would be wonderful, it just needs to be done true to the characters and not any cookie cutter fantasy. :D

Otoh, I did write a fic based on that domesticity. Well, it started that way and morphed into sex games. Damn those boys for turning my mind to smut. :blusher:


I'm not down with the domesticity thing at all (in fic or on the program) but it has nothing to do with sexual orientation, to me. Gwen/Rhys domestic stuff (Or Jack and Gwen, for that matter) does nothing for me either. If G/R have kids I'll fall asleep.

[time_vortex]

I think someone made a point earlier saying that Gwen/Jack is a damsel in distress complex almost. I don't agree with this, I think its more of a power control problem, I think Jack and Gwen are able to balance each other because they are totally different leaders and are constantly fighting for some kind of control.

I also don't think that domesticity for Janto will work because there is no way to be domestic, unless Ianto can figure out a way to live forever (which unless in fanfic is highly unlikely). jack always has these problems with falling in love and watching the ones he loves die and get old without him. Jack just doesn't equal domesticity of any sort.

[Aquila]

I can't speak for everyone, but when I say domesticity, I'm thinking more along the lines of waking up together, eating, showering, getting ready for work, taking out the trash and arguing over the remote or who has to do the dishes...you know, every day things. It doesn't mean settling down in married bliss in an ivy filled cottage, etc...just the sharing of those everyday moments.

[PoisonIvy]

It doesn't mean settling down in married bliss in an ivy filled cottage, etc...just the sharing of those everyday moments.

Oh, come on... what if I want to fill their cottage?!?! :tongue:

[AutumnRose]

I also don't think that domesticity for Janto will work because there is no way to be domestic, unless Ianto can figure out a way to live forever (which unless in fanfic is highly unlikely). jack always has these problems with falling in love and watching the ones he loves die and get old without him. Jack just doesn't equal domesticity of any sort.



I completely agree with you, time_vortex. With their jobs, its impossible for them to do everyday, normal things. The most domestic these two get is with Ianto helping Jack into his coat. But this does not cheapen their relationship in any way shape or form. Actually, I prefer it this way, domestic Janto just doesn't sit right with me for some reason.

[time_vortex]

AutumnRose,I don't think it cheapens there relationship at all. I think it makes Janto have a certain quality that makes it a more attractive ship, that constant danger looming over their heads makes it more interesting to me as a fan. The fact that it is also sort of doomed gives the ship an edge aswell.

I agree also with what you are saying on them not being able to be domestic because of their jobs or w/e. The show shows the more domestic side of torchwood within the Gwen/Rhys storyline and look how difficult that is for them. Janto has almost a secret affair appeal to it and that is why i follow Janto rather than Gwack or other ships.

[Aquila]

It doesn't mean settling down in married bliss in an ivy filled cottage, etc...just the sharing of those everyday moments.

Oh, come on... what if I want to fill their cottage?!?! :tongue:
With sex toys? Video cameras? Innuendo?

This is Jack and Ianto we're talking about. The cctv is already installed. :spite:

[Aquila]

I also don't think that domesticity for Janto will work because there is no way to be domestic, unless Ianto can figure out a way to live forever (which unless in fanfic is highly unlikely). jack always has these problems with falling in love and watching the ones he loves die and get old without him. Jack just doesn't equal domesticity of any sort.



I completely agree with you, time_vortex. With their jobs, its impossible for them to do everyday, normal things. The most domestic these two get is with Ianto helping Jack into his coat. But this does not cheapen their relationship in any way shape or form. Actually, I prefer it this way, domestic Janto just doesn't sit right with me for some reason.
What, they don't eat? They don't shower? They don't have to buy new clothes and toiletries on occasion? They never have to pick up their dirty underwear? They don't sleep? Sure, Jack rarely does, but Jack does need to get dressed one foot at a time. He still needs to take a crap. Life is life.

I think our definitions of domesticity are clashing. Or rather, domesticity is not the right word, but I can't think of a better one.

Point is, regardless of their jobs and living situations, I'd just like to see some evidence that they're sharing their lives with each other, cause that's what they're doing. Pure and simple. Life still happens while they're busy saving the world. Also, there is no reason why they can't be domestic in their day to day routine, regardless of the fact that Jack will out live Ianto. The fact is, even if Jack wasn't immortal one of them would likely die first. In this particular circumstance, immortality or the lack of it means nothing.

[PoisonIvy]

It doesn't mean settling down in married bliss in an ivy filled cottage, etc...just the sharing of those everyday moments.

Oh, come on... what if I want to fill their cottage?!?! :tongue:
With sex toys? Video cameras? Innuendo?

This is Jack and Ianto we're talking about. The cctv is already installed. :spite:

LOL. Nonononono... silly, with myself. :wink:

You said, "in an ivy filled cottage"... :happy:

[Aquila]

It doesn't mean settling down in married bliss in an ivy filled cottage, etc...just the sharing of those everyday moments.

Oh, come on... what if I want to fill their cottage?!?! :tongue:
With sex toys? Video cameras? Innuendo?

This is Jack and Ianto we're talking about. The cctv is already installed. :spite:

LOL. Nonononono... silly, with myself. :wink:

You said, "in an ivy filled cottage"... :happy:
:laugh:

[Michael]

I was thinking the same thing! :D

[Jack-Ianto88]

hey didn't mean to start up a debate on domestic life. but what Aquila said pretty much sums up what i think about domestic life.


I can't speak for everyone, but when I say domesticity, I'm thinking more along the lines of waking up together, eating, showering, getting ready for work, taking out the trash and arguing over the remote or who has to do the dishes...you know, every day things. It doesn't mean settling down in married bliss in an ivy filled cottage, etc...just the sharing of those everyday moments.

That's what i think of domesticity.

[AutumnRose]

That is what domesticity means to me, too. And whilst I think that they probably wake up together, shower, eat together etc. I just can't see them arguing over the TV remote or who has do the dishes. (I mean seriously, Jack dishes?) It's more likely that Ianto moans about Jack treading mud through the hub (or having egg on his collar ...)

However, I think they are sharing their lives as both of Jack and Ianto's lives are Torchwood. Without it they'd have no-one and be nothing. I think the shared experience stuff comes from the danger of the job. So whilst they have some level of domesticity, I don't think its an integeral part of their relationship. I've always thought it was more about acceptance and trust than domestcitity.

[CrazyTinsel_Lottie]

In torchwood magazine gareth says that there are a few good scenes between them.... If they destroy their relationship i will personally shoot Russel t Davies or whoever else does it!

[deedeedee123]

If they destroy their relationship i will personally shoot Russel t Davies or whoever else does it!
If that happens I think there may be a line of people wanting to do that lol

[Aquila]

That is what domesticity means to me, too. And whilst I think that they probably wake up together, shower, eat together etc. I just can't see them arguing over the TV remote or who has do the dishes. (I mean seriously, Jack dishes?) It's more likely that Ianto moans about Jack treading mud through the hub (or having egg on his collar ...)

However, I think they are sharing their lives as both of Jack and Ianto's lives are Torchwood. Without it they'd have no-one and be nothing. I think the shared experience stuff comes from the danger of the job. So whilst they have some level of domesticity, I don't think its an integeral part of their relationship. I've always thought it was more about acceptance and trust than domestcitity.
Gotcha. :wink:

The more I think about it, the more it's a perfect relationship. Jack may well drive Ianto to murder him, but at least it won't stick. Ianto works out his frustrations and Jack will be fine soon enough. It's a match made in heaven. :yes:

I am, of course, kidding. :lol:

[Aquila]

If they destroy their relationship i will personally shoot Russel t Davies or whoever else does it!
If that happens I think there may be a line of people wanting to do that lol
Well, I may not want to actually shoot him, but I will beadmouth him to anyone who will listen adn some who don't want to.

:blusher:

[Jack-Ianto88]

i would be pissed too

[blaid drwg]

I would cry :nope:

[time_vortex]

When I say domestic i mean like get married, like Rhys and Gwen, not like taking showers or eating.

much sadness if Janto is cut off too soon :( :beg:

[nikkonekko]

I can't speak for everyone, but when I say domesticity, I'm thinking more along the lines of waking up together, eating, showering, getting ready for work, taking out the trash and arguing over the remote or who has to do the dishes...you know, every day things. It doesn't mean settling down in married bliss in an ivy filled cottage, etc...just the sharing of those everyday moments.

All right, I'm late to the conversation. But, anyway, I wouldn't even need anything too elaborate or a big scene along these lines to make me happy. All it would take to make me squee a bit is a throw-away line from Ianto like: " Jack, you left the cap off the toothpaste again." or "You didn't put the milk back into the fridge this morning".

[time_vortex]

i agree nikkonekko, that would make me squee too..

they just need to look at each other to make me squee.

[Kaleidoscope]

All right, I'm late to the conversation. But, anyway, I wouldn't even need anything too elaborate or a big scene along these lines to make me happy. All it would take to make me squee a bit is a throw-away line from Ianto like: " Jack, you left the cap off the toothpaste again." or "You didn't put the milk back into the fridge this morning".
Yeah! Only Ianto would do it really sarcastically like "I'll put the cap back on the toothpaste shall I?" and Jack could make some saucy comment like "Good idea. We don't want the bathroom covered in white sticky mess again." Ianto: "I wouldn't go that far, sir..."

Okay I've thought about this way too much :laugh:

[Aquila]

All right, I'm late to the conversation. But, anyway, I wouldn't even need anything too elaborate or a big scene along these lines to make me happy. All it would take to make me squee a bit is a throw-away line from Ianto like: " Jack, you left the cap off the toothpaste again." or "You didn't put the milk back into the fridge this morning".
Yeah! Only Ianto would do it really sarcastically like "I'll put the cap back on the toothpaste shall I?" and Jack could make some saucy comment like "Good idea. We don't want the bathroom covered in white sticky mess again." Ianto: "I wouldn't go that far, sir..."

Okay I've thought about this way too much :laugh:
:laugh:

Also, :faint:

:blusher:

[not_the_teaboy]

I certainly hope they don't mess up Janto in this coming season. And I suppose 'mess up' or 'wreck' are relative terms depending on who you're talking to. Everyone has, and is entitled to their own opinion. Let's just hope that the writers don't see fit to kill Ianto (I would bawl and have to seriously think about watching the next season) or break up Jack and Ianto (I'd still watch, there's always a make up... you never know).

As for what I'd be happy with seeing. Just little things mostly. Hints that they actually have a relationship other than just the occasional shag. And of course more kissing or skin is always good as well!

[AutumnRose]

I don't think they will kill Ianto. They've just killed off two team members, so the shock of loosing main characters is gone. Also, leaving the remaining three together is an interesting dynamic considering Jack's feelings for both Ianto and Gwen. But if they do kill Ianto, I will stop watching (ha - stopwatch! :laugh: ) but seriously, Ianto is the most interesting charater. He presents himself as polite, well spoken and very professional, when in reality, he's shagging his boss. He's also very dark and insecure, but he has this creative and playful side. (And he has a stopwatch fetish - what could be more awesome?) I think there is lots more to discover about Ianto, and lots more room for his development. Personally, I think the writers would be mad to kill Ianto off!

As for his relationship with Jack, I don't think they will wreck it. The only way it could be wrecked for me is if they set up house and had babies. Which ain't gonna happen. I can't see Jack and Ianto breaking up, mainly because they'd both be lonelier than ever. However, I hope in series 3 there is some tension, because it keeps their relationship interesting and exciting, but balanced with tender moments.

And ofcourse I want more snogging and flesh! Hell, if it were up to me, Ianto would be naked for a good portion of every episode. With a side dish of naked Jack as well. :blusher:

BTW not_the_teaboy love your sig!

[torchwoodfan]

I hope we have more Janto in season 3! :hello:

[Janto_Love]

If they kill Janto i will cry and be very very upset.
I dont think i will stop watching.
But yeah...

[Acirederf+]

Ianto is the most interesting charater. He presents himself as polite, well spoken and very professional, when in reality, he's shagging his boss.



Haha! That pretty much made my day *needs to read forums more often XD* :lol2:

[AutumnRose]

:laugh: Thanks! I need to read this forum less often ...

[AutumnRose]

Double post, oops!

[Aquila]

Ianto is the most interesting charater. He presents himself as polite, well spoken and very professional, when in reality, he's shagging his boss.



Haha! That pretty much made my day *needs to read forums more often XD* :lol2:
That's a great point, right there. :good: Love it. :yes:

[Captain_Angel]

oh! dear!

Ianto and Jack well I loved them to much and they have got me hooked since having the boxsets. I mean when i brought series one boxset and have now got the others since they came out. first watched Torchwood at my grandmas house while waiting for a house (a bungalow) with my parents. Watched the first episode downstairs at grandmas house in mom and dads bedroom because we didn't have cable upstairs because it was my grandmas house and i would have to pay for it. I put a load of captain jack stuff in the room where i was staying. thus my grandmas hooked on captain jack harkness. :woot:

We now have our bungalow and i've got a room and it blue. it look like a hub. :blusher: :swoon: :laugh2: